Comments on MamaFlo's Place: POVERTY, What's causing it? What Can Be Done? Is...

I agree with some of this....I agree people should...

2008-07-12T15:02:51.346-05:00

I agree with some of this....
I agree people should NOT keep having kids if they can't even afford the ones they have.
To use babies as a way to get extra income from the government is inexcusable.

However, I also agree with the people who have explained that this is not a black and white, cut-and-dried issue. As Maggie explained, sometimes it actually creates worse poverty if someone DOES get a job. Sad but absolutely true.
It's not as simple as "working is good, welfare is bad".
Neither is it as simple as blaming people for "not having motivation."

I agree with you that liquor and cigarettes should be very, very low priority for someone who can barely afford food.
Really, someone in that position should probably make every effort to stop smoking and drinking entirely. That stuff can be expensive.

I do take issue with your statement that "If you can't find work where you live, live where you can find work." Sadly, the vast majority of poor people simply can not afford to move. Even people who aren't on welfare might not be able to just pick up and move to a new city/state, buy a new house, start fresh. Homes are expensive. Rent is expensive. Mortgages are expensive. For people who can't even afford to fill their gas tanks every week, buying a new home is just not realistic.

Overall, I think we agree about 50%.
Not bad. :)

I agree!I am a social worker and see people make s...

2008-07-07T18:36:18.405-05:00

I agree!
I am a social worker and see people make stupid decisions all the time as if they are trying to be poor. Most American poverty is caused by self-destructive behaviour. (Visit my blog and see the post How to be Poor)

I truly agree with consciousness awakening part of...

2008-07-07T01:33:34.592-05:00

I truly agree with consciousness awakening part of the post.!
People rating poverty as poor from their hearts is the first step towards any revolution to be taking place..

The Millennium Development goals of the UN..works this principle..!
They want people to think..question themselves and then come forward to their bit in the cause..!
It has being doing enormous efforts on these lines….
This year UN will be shifting its focus on India, with Stand Up and Take action event and getting many hands together to fulfill the 8 goals…
Be updated….with the latest happeningss..
http://www.orkut.co.in/Community.aspx?cmm=47234928

This is a tough one because it's rarely so black a...

2008-07-07T01:19:22.414-05:00

This is a tough one because it's rarely so black and white, and once you've fallen into the hole enough, it's harder to get out. Circumstances give different people different tools to either make the climb or not, too.

Back in college, I broke a friendship over someone buying ingredients for our lunch (plus steak for her dinner) on food stamps and then throwing away leftovers that would have fed us for a couple meals, and I don't believe in that kind of abuse of assistance.

That said...

Someone on assistance trying to get off of it who works hard enough to get a raise only to see that the assistance suddenly gone completely (instead of a common sense adjustment), even though the raise doesn't bridge the gap and instead means even less money, enough less that losing the job may be the only way to afford groceries again. Hardly an incentive.

I deleted the rest of my rambling that was here. I hate seeing the system abused, but I also don't think it is always as cut and dry as we'd like to assume. Sometimes it is, and in those cases, I'm just as outraged as you are. Meanwhile, I'm scared to death that as my grocery bill and gasoline prices rise without the paycheck increasing (where I work, some paychecks have gone down while others have gone away entirely), someday I could be one of those even with my education and willingness to work. Just saying.

I want to know why people keep having babies who c...

2008-07-06T22:24:23.144-05:00

I want to know why people keep having babies who can't afford them, and it's as if the government rewards them for doing so? Now really, they have free daycare rooms in the high schools up here. Somebody ought to wake the politicians up.

greed causes poverty.people who have opportunities...

2008-07-06T21:57:32.700-05:00

greed causes poverty.

people who have opportunities to educate themselves, but don't. the freaking library is open 7 days a week.

laziness causes poverty. too lazy to do it yourself and always waiting for people to give you something.

a corrupt government causes poverty.

selfishness causes poverty.

lack of natural affection causes poverty.

pride causes poverty.

people cause poverty. people create poverty. there is enough food and land on this earth for everyone to bed fed and housed.

hparis,Mentally and Physically challenged individu...

2008-07-06T20:33:00.636-05:00

hparis,
Mentally and Physically challenged individuals are what assistance was meant for. I'm not talking about you or this "child", I'm talking about the deadbeats that live off the system generation after generation and produce children simply to get more money and then spend the money on drugs and alcohol. They walk the streets and hang out on street corners when they should be out working.

This topic makes my blood boil!!!!

It seems everywhere I go I'm seeing posts about th...

2008-07-06T19:51:33.618-05:00

It seems everywhere I go I'm seeing posts about this topic, and yet there are enough folks out there who vote for politicians who encourage entitlement.

I have a kid living with me who is on SSI. She is mentally retarded, but highly functional. She wants to get off the system because she sees how it encourages laziness. Yeah, this coming from a kid with a 5th grade reading level! Too bad the liberal college elite are unable to make such astute observations.

Unfortunately, I'm a property owner who IS only making $10 an hour. If I could afford it, I'd tell her to tell SS to take a hike, but unfortunately, she gets much needed Medicaid since she is also epileptic and needs meds.

At heart, I am a Libertarian on this issue, but practically, I don't know how I would care for the kid if it weren't for the handout.

I've never received a government handout in my life. I've always depended on my own means and the kindness of family members who've loaned me money. But I live in an area where there is a 26% unemployment rate and parentless children running rampant on the streets at all hours of the night.

Agree with you on a ton of points. Kudo's to Lori ...

2008-07-06T19:36:36.769-05:00

Agree with you on a ton of points. Kudo's to Lori for using it the way it was meant to be used. I could stay and write a book on my feelings on this subject but I won't. I will just say I have a dead beat Aunt that uses the system to the Max. Her daughter lives off the prison system. Her two son's did Acid and now have diagnosis of skitzophrenic. (spelling) so they now rob the disability system. Guess she taught her kids well.... Good Grief...

I couldn't agree with you more. You took the words...

2008-07-06T18:28:32.716-05:00

I couldn't agree with you more. You took the words right out of my mouth. I have gotten into several heated arguments about this topic. I don't understand the sense of entitlement this generation has. They want it all and on a silver platter and don't want to work or sweat for any of it.

The welfare system does not work. For every one person who really needs it and should have it, there are 10 who abuse it. It blows my mind that people sell their food stamps for money so they can buy drugs or alcohol. I know one young lady who keeps have baby's just so she can get more money and more food stamps.

When I am told that nobody really wants to be on Welfare, I could scream. Yes they do! That is the mentality that they have and they feel they are entitled to it. I can't believe how many people are now collecting SSI. I have come across whole family's that collect. I know one guy who collects SSI because..are you ready for this. He was too fat!!!! Yet there are people who have worked their tails off, paid into the system get hurt or get a disease and have to fight to be able to collect. It makes my head spin.

I wonder how fast their lazy butts would go to work, if it all just stopped!

Don't get me wrong. I think there should be a system to help people get back on their feet. A short term system. I don't think generations should live off the govt, and we the tax payers should pay for it. I better stop now.

Wow, nice post. You go girl !!!

2008-07-06T14:32:22.086-05:00

Wow, nice post. You go girl !!!

It's the same in my country and I agree with every...

2008-07-06T14:16:56.118-05:00

It's the same in my country and I agree with everything you say. Too many people nowadays believe that the state owes them a living when they have never done a day's work in their life. This is a subject that really winds me up so I'd better stop now.

Lori, I agree with what you are saying. You used ...

2008-07-06T13:25:15.590-05:00

Lori, I agree with what you are saying. You used public assistance the way it was meant to be used.
Like I said, society and all the money in the world isn't going to change this problem, people must find self respect and that along with short term assistance will be enough to end "poverty."

I'm mixed on this. My sister works in an inner cit...

2008-07-06T12:41:12.783-05:00

I'm mixed on this. My sister works in an inner city school. The children are in fourth grade, so they're what - 10? The parents, if there are two parents, are in their early 20s. Grandparents? Late thirties. She said the kids were floored when they learned she was married to the father of her children.

It's not as simple as expecting people to live within their means. It's about breaking a cycle that's generations old, and helpng today's kids understand personal and social responsibility.

When I divorced, I had to go on food stamps. I had no choice. I was raising two kids and I had no education. It was embarrassing, but it was a huge help at a time I desperately needed it. What I can tell you about welfare - you cannot have more than $2K in assets TOTAL in any savings or checking account, including that of your children. If you live with someone, that person's income must count as part of yours (in my case, I had to count my parents' Social Security as my income even though I paid my way with a part-time job). The system has checks and balances, but it works more to keep people in a vicious cycle than it helps them to go to school, get an education, and do so on their own dime.

I'm not a silver-spoon kind of person either, but I think the larger picture involves many more variables than we can ever understand until we're there.

Oh lord are you ever right!! I have tried to expla...

2008-07-06T10:54:22.061-05:00

Oh lord are you ever right!! I have tried to explain this to certain *ahem* more liberal than me people and always get chewed out for being a bigot. I guess I am racist against welfare moochers lmao.

I have personally known a few people who work the welfare system and were living better than we were, despite our hard work and determination. It really pisses me off!!! :/